Up for Debate: Facebook's faceplant

Thursday, May 24, 2012 at 2:22am

As the Facebook I.P.O. hubbub plays out, do you smell a rat? Do you think average investors may have lost out on information provided to larger investors? Do you believe that when all's said and done the Securities and Exchange Commission will have reason to call foul?

Filed under: City Voices

130 Comments on this post:

By: dargent7 on 5/24/12 at 4:30

A rat? No, just your usual band of theives.
With 980 million users, Facebook runs 1/7th of the planet Earth.
The IPO was valued too high at $38. a share.
I have no idea who decides and sets the initial stock offering's price, or how it's done.
If someone's hands are dirty, they'll find out.

By: Ask01 on 5/24/12 at 4:35

One can always hope facebook will fall from grace and become a stigma, a pariah shunned by everyone, particularly short sighted public forums requiring the odious service to opine.

If they beg, and are genuinely repentant, some of us might consider returning.

By: Ummm... on 5/24/12 at 4:52

Sic Semper Tyrannis!

By: yogiman on 5/24/12 at 4:54

I've only been logged on to facebook because my daughter got me on it. I'm there in name only. I never use it.

By: yogiman on 5/24/12 at 4:58

It's a different subject, but a more important one about the Obamacare health program.
www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=HcBaSP31Be*&vg=medium

Make sure you're sitting down when you hear it.

By: gdiafante on 5/24/12 at 5:09

My god...Ummm is John Wilkes Booth...

Scarlett...stop watching those propaganda films. It'll rot your brain cell.

By: yogiman on 5/24/12 at 6:16

Are you a fellow communist with Barry, gdiafarte? You're sure indicating you are, unless you've read that 2700 page document Nancy Pelosi told congress they must sign before they read it so they will understand it.

If it is such a good program, why did congress not use that old KISS program and put themselves in it with the common citizens?

You can think whatever you wish of me, gdiafarte, I could care less. But in the long run, your children are going to be put on the governments programs placing them under government control.

By: gdiafante on 5/24/12 at 6:22

"Birtherism is a fringe issue that's way out of the mainstream, and it's disturbing when you see people you ... have some level of respect for, whether it's members of Congress or even Donald Trump, falling into that category," said Steve Schmidt, one of Sen. John McCain's senior advisers in 2008. "In the middle of the electorate, people think it's bats--t crazy. The side that's seen flirting with it doesn't do themselves any favors."

http://www.cnn.com/2012/05/23/politics/birthers-arizona-iowa/index.html?hpt=hp_c2

By: dargent7 on 5/24/12 at 6:36

I like the fact "yogi" is now attacking a Marine. (board certified).
As I said yesterday, The LA Times ran Obama's "Certificate of Live Birth".
If it's a forgery, it had to cost him $10. million. The retrofitting all the birth announcements in the Honolulu Advertiser for Aug.4, 1961 another $5. million. Pay off some Drs. and nurses who would say them distinctly remember delivering a small black child from a white woman. Another couple grand.
Then bribe thousands of Americans to vote for him, vs. an aged, war hero dating back to 1972. Who bragged he didn't have a cell phone or knew how to use e-mail or the Internet. Then, win decisively.
I guess the guy from Kenya really wanted to be President. Badly.

By: yogiman on 5/24/12 at 6:59

You're right on one issue, dargent7. That guy from Kenya did really want to be President. Badly.

I hope I'm still livng when you people discover your ignorance. You don't seem to be able to see beyond your noses.

The so-called birth certificate shown yesterday is the same fake shown before. And it still boils down to the fact: Why has Obama refused to prove his identity. Why doesn't he want you to know who he is? And don't tell me you know who he is, because he refuses to identify himself.

By: Rasputin72 on 5/24/12 at 7:02

As an investor one must always be cognizant of the first objective of Wall Street. If you can see daylight through the facade of Wall Street and never try to beat these jackals at their own game you can be successful.

Wall Street wants to protect their own. They want to make lots of money using the capital of millions and millions of various types of investors. Those like myself with some skills,some with only the most naive information and those that think they can trade like Wall Street.

Armed with other peoples money Wall Street is able to take some risks that they would never take with their own money. The first objective for them is to make money for themselves and if there is any left over they will return it to the people who supplied the capital.

In the case of Facebook, Wall Street and Morgan Stanley were faced with such demand for the stock (for reasons that will always elude me) they priced the stock based not on the value of the stock but on the knowledge that the public would buy the stock at almost any price.
I find the Obama administration to be against everything I am for. In this case however I hope the Democrats string the Wall Street boys up by the thumbs. I am convinced that Wall Street not Republicans in general have done more damage to the fabric of America than all of the entitlements this country provides to the worthless.

By: Kosh III on 5/24/12 at 7:04

"Do you think average investors may have lost out on information provided to larger investors?"

Of course the insiders and Wall Street/bank crooks get preferential treament.

The SEC will do nothing because they are just as crooked as the Wall Street crooks.

Next topic: What is your favourite colour?

By: Ummm... on 5/24/12 at 7:04

d7- you don't understand! The vast communist conspiracy to put a usurper in the White House started way back then (1961) when the secret deals were made to falsify a half-black child's birth records and then groom him on a diet of dog meat in Indonesia to be not only a communist, but a man's-best-friend-eating muslim sympathizer as well. The evil conspirators number in the thousands, but none of them will blow the whistle because they are being paid off with vast amounts of campaign funds from Obama. The evil plan is working to perfection, and after his re-election Obama plans to declare himself king of the United States, and demand that all citizens worship him as a god- and that's just the beginning... (ain't that right, yogi?)

By: yogiman on 5/24/12 at 7:15

dargent7,

Doesn't it make sense to you and your fellow posters here that under all of the circmstances brought forth the man sitting in the Oval Office would just laugh and say; Here it is, folks. Look at it and have a great day?

You didn't know who you voted for in 2008 and you still don't know who's in the race now. But as I have noted before; Why has congress allowed all of this to happen?

Marco Rubio has been brought up too often as Romney's VP running mate. If they bring him into the picture, that, in essence, simply puts both parties on the same ticket. Rubio is no more eligible than Obama. So where are they taking this nation?

By: Rasputin72 on 5/24/12 at 7:16

Ummm......How were you able to come across this kind of information? You might be careful making public this information.

By: Loner on 5/24/12 at 7:22

Good morning, Nashville!

As the Facebook I.P.O. hubbub plays out, do you smell a rat? I smell several 2-legged rodents on this deal....they give rats a bad name.

Do you think average investors may have lost out on information provided to larger investors? Of course they did....this was the premier sweetheart deal of the decade....or so they were told.

Do you believe that when all's said and done the Securities and Exchange Commission will have reason to call foul? Nope. These guys are all in the same club...didn't Bernie Madoff once head up the SEC? Expect a statement, but nothing more.

Those zuckers who went with the flow may get flushed into the sewers of financial failure....the rats, however, will survive the flushing....they always do.

By: Loner on 5/24/12 at 7:33

I went to post on a story about the Iranian nuclear talks in Baghdad on Voice of America...it went Facebook...could not comment there...so I went to a related story in the LA Times....again, they too have switched over to Zuckerberg's expanding monopoly on Comment Boards....I used to post on those two sites.....No mas!

I want Facebook to fail completely, so that I can continue to comment on news articles that strike my interest on Comment Boards hosted by the media outlets themselves and not operated by some universal Comment Board Authority with an itchy censorship finger and a Zionist agenda.

By: Rasputin72 on 5/24/12 at 7:35

LONER........Your last paragraph would have gotten you an A in a journalism class. The ability to say as much as you can with as few words as possible is always a great tool for every journalist.

There will today be hundreds of thousands of words written about this "facebook" subject none will be anymore concise than "The zuckers who went with the flow may get flushed into the sewers of financial failure....the rats, however will survive the flushing.....they always do."

By: yogiman on 5/24/12 at 7:49

That facebook issue is one of the few things I agree with you on, Loner. When I think about making a comment on a subject and they throw that punch at me in the ring, I just go back to my corner to take an eight count.

Kinda makes you wonder why several of those young men are leaving the country... for tax purposes, of course.

By: yogiman on 5/24/12 at 7:51

Are you referring to my comment in your 8:16 post, Rasputin72? If it is, you must be blind not to see it.

By: gdiafante on 5/24/12 at 8:00

I am convinced that Wall Street not Republicans in general have done more damage to the fabric of America than all of the entitlements this country provides to the worthless.

You don't think the government is complicit to the workings of Wall Street.? And I mean the government, not one party. Corruption is an equal opportunity employer.

If there's a perception that the GOP is more involved, it's because (1) they are firmly anti-regulation, (2) they are pro free-market and (3) they champion big business.

The Democrats, though on the payroll of Wall Street as well, are seen as (1) believing in a well regulated private industry, (2) anti-big business and (3) champion "main street" (not the main street in downtown Franklin, the one in Antioch)

Those are the perceptions. The reality is the U.S. Government is bought and paid for by Wall Street.

By: govskeptic on 5/24/12 at 8:11

Millions of shares sold between $38.00 up to about 41.75 on opening
date! Like most other IPO's this one had money set aside to support
the share price for a period of time, in this case one billion dollars in
support, which I suppose they used all of it. So, a $28.00 stock sold
for $38-42.00 per share, a few did well, many did poorly at this point!
That's the way it works!

By: Loner on 5/24/12 at 8:45

Thank you Rasputin, for the feedback on my writing skills. I assume the comment was genuine.

Again, i credit-blame the Felician nuns...they did teach us how to express ourselves....but they set limits on content, of course....I got a "Runner-up" award once, while in parochial school, in a Diocese-wide essay contest....that was the best that anybody did in our little schoolhouse...we were on the fringe of the Buffalo Diocese...bordering the Rochester Diocese...for a boy in the hinterlands to get a "Runner-up" award was a breakthrough....our nuns were quite proud.

Later, in public High School, against all advice, I took the Essay part of the NYS English Regents exam, as a senior....I aced it...tied for highest grade on the exam in our relatively large High School.

But those two honors are very old and quite petty....the praise that comes from an ideological adversary is worth more than all that...thanks Rasp.

By: Rasputin72 on 5/24/12 at 8:46

No, Yogi, I was referring to comments made by Ummm at 8:04

By: Loner on 5/24/12 at 8:58

IMO, FBs "demise" can be traced to the Announcement by GM that it would no longer advertise on the FB medium....they claimed that the ad response rate was dismal...worse than most online sites...no bang for the buck, according to GM....that spooked people....GM has pulled the valve stems out of FB's tires and they are going flat ...Zuckerberg is pumping in air...and pumping his new bride...as fast as he can...but even gifted men like Mr. Zuckerberg have their limits....if I owned any of their stock, I'd dump it ASAP.

If lawsuits bedevil the Zuckies, we can add loss of fuel to the flat tires....the Zuckermobile may go the way of the Locomobile.

http://www.american-automobiles.com/images3/1904-Locomobile.jpg

By: yogiman on 5/24/12 at 9:13

Thanks, Rasputin72, I didn't read all of Ummm's comment when it didn't look like he knew what he was "talking" about.

Ummm, you should look deeper into a situation before making such facetious comments.

Let's be honest: You don't even know who in the hell the man calling himself Barack Obama is because he refuses to identify himself. Haven't you ever wondered why?

By: brrrrk on 5/24/12 at 9:13

Kosh III said

"The SEC will do nothing because they are just as crooked as the Wall Street crooks."

First of all, I'm not defending the SEC for any kind of performance... good or bad, but there's one thing I do know, the SEC has been under budgetary attack for at least the past 12 years. It has also been populated by pro-wall street investigators that I'm sure choose to look the other way at times (if you're looking for crooks.... that's where you find them). The SEC has constantly been under attack by Republicans and even though there have been budgetary increases over the past few years, they have been minimal given the ever increasing size of the overall market. Even now the right is pushing for a $222 million dollar decrease in the SEC's budget. This makes as much sense as saying that if we cut the number of cops on the street, crime will go down.

By: gdiafante on 5/24/12 at 9:21

Scarlett, you should be more worried about Tara's loss of value and the impending property tax increase. You may need to wear the curtains again.

By: Beernazi on 5/24/12 at 9:24

Of all the falsehoods told about President Barack Obama, the biggest whopper is the one about his reckless spending spree.

As would-be president Mitt Romney tells it: “I will lead us out of this debt and spending inferno.”

Almost everyone believes that Obama has presided over a massive increase in federal spending, an “inferno” of spending that threatens our jobs, our businesses and our children’s future. Even Democrats seem to think it’s true.

But it didn’t happen. Although there was a big stimulus bill under Obama, federal spending is rising at the slowest pace since Dwight Eisenhower brought the Korean War to an end in the 1950s.

By: Beernazi on 5/24/12 at 9:24

• In the 2009 fiscal year — the last of George W. Bush’s presidency — federal spending rose by 17.9% from $2.98 trillion to $3.52 trillion. Check the official numbers at the Office of Management and Budget.
• In fiscal 2010 — the first budget under Obama — spending fell 1.8% to $3.46 trillion.
• In fiscal 2011, spending rose 4.3% to $3.60 trillion.
• In fiscal 2012, spending is set to rise 0.7% to $3.63 trillion, according to the Congressional Budget Office’s estimate of the budget that was agreed to last August.
• Finally in fiscal 2013 — the final budget of Obama’s term — spending is scheduled to fall 1.3% to $3.58 trillion.

http://theimmoralminority.blogspot.com/2012/05/gop-claim-that-president-obama-has.html

By: Beernazi on 5/24/12 at 9:27

We found that Obama has indeed presided over the slowest growth in spending of any president using raw dollars, and the growth on his watch was the second-slowest if you adjust for inflation.

http://freakoutnation.com/2012/05/24/politifact-obama-has-indeed-presided-over-the-slowest-growth-in-spending-of-any-president/

By: brrrrk on 5/24/12 at 9:37

Romney likes to trot out Steel Dynamics as Baines big success story. The truth is that Baine would have never "succeeded" without a sizable investment ($37 million) from..... guess.... government. And while Baine walked away with a whopping $104 million (a return of more than $85 million) the residents of the Indiana county where the plant is located are still paying higher taxes to cover part of the public investment.

http://articles.latimes.com/2012/jan/12/nation/la-na-bain-subsidies-20120113

By: Loner on 5/24/12 at 9:37

Looks like President Obama has failed to substantially roll back the levels of spending that he inherited from Bush-Cheney....according to BN's stats, there was a brief flirtation with a decrease in spending in 2010...the 2013 budget is a projected figure...we could be at war by then and soaring fuel costs could stall the recovery.

If Obama had reduced federal spending to the pre-Bush levels, then he could crow about it. Obama has kept the War Lobby in business....and we all gonna pay for dat, Jack....hope & change...or....shuck & jive?

By: Beernazi on 5/24/12 at 9:41

Loner, the spending has slowed and if you look at the stats and adjust for inflation, it was the second-lowest spending growth. And it is budged to fall in 2013. So it's not factual to say that he "failed substantially to roll back the levels of spending."

By: Beernazi on 5/24/12 at 9:42

Check out the links for more indepth info.

By: Beernazi on 5/24/12 at 9:43

Don't forget that when you talk about reducing federal spending to the pre-Bush levels you have to adjust for inflation so it's not dollar for dollar.

By: Loner on 5/24/12 at 9:43

Romney used the term, "inferno"? I am surprised that he did not use the term, "Lake of Fire"...to fire up the Evangelical End-Timers....the guy needs me on his speech-writing staff....but I don't work that cheap....Willard does not pay top dollar...it's a sweat-shop deal....you get what you pay for, Willard....you zuck!

By: brrrrk on 5/24/12 at 9:53

Beernazi said

"Don't forget that when you talk about reducing federal spending to the pre-Bush levels you have to adjust for inflation so it's not dollar for dollar."

Good point. For example, you can look at the increase of the deficit under Reagan and think, "well that doesn't look that bad". But if you look at it in the context of everything else at the time, Reagan actually tripled the deficit. But yet Obama is getting skewered for what is (when taken in context) a minor increase in the budget. By the way, you don't hear the right wing crowing about the two modern administrations that actually decreased the budget do you? Could it be because both of them had "D"'s in front of their names?

By: Loner on 5/24/12 at 9:54

Like gasoline prices, government spending gets ratcheted upwards...then they go back down a click or two, but levels remain higher than they were before the jacking up occurred...after a brief pause...say a couple of extended news cycles...the ratcheting up begins anew and the pattern repeats itself.

The motorists and the taxpayers are being jacked.....ever upwards...the higher we go, the more unstable the situation....the jack could slip.....the whole thing could tip....but they keep working that jack handle.

By: Rasputin72 on 5/24/12 at 9:54

LONER.....It was genuine. An advesary is not to be disrespected if he can think clearly how to pursue his or her point of view.

From my vantage point there are many of the people who support your ideology. Unfortunately the support comes from their inability to have an ideology. Their support is strictly from a myriad of personal bias projections.

By: Rasputin72 on 5/24/12 at 9:54

LONER.....It was genuine. An advesary is not to be disrespected if he can think clearly how to pursue his or her point of view.

From my vantage point there are many of the people who support your ideology. Unfortunately the support comes from their inability to have an ideology. Their support is strictly from a myriad of personal bias projections.

By: brrrrk on 5/24/12 at 10:04

Loner said

"Like gasoline prices, government spending gets ratcheted upwards...then they go back down a click or two, but levels remain higher than they were before the jacking up occurred...after a brief pause...say a couple of extended news cycles...the ratcheting up begins anew and the pattern repeats itself."

True, but it still all has to be taken in context. For example, I found a mileage and gas log that my dad kept for a trip that our family took to Florida when I was a kid. We paid an average of.... get this..... 15 cents a gallon for gas. But at the same time, I bet my dad wasn't making more than $6,000 a year then.

By: brrrrk on 5/24/12 at 10:07

Rasputin72 said

"From my vantage point there are many of the people who support your ideology. Unfortunately the support comes from their inability to have an ideology. Their support is strictly from a myriad of personal bias projections."

And facts have a liberal bias.....

By: slacker on 5/24/12 at 10:13

Loner, you would be a terrific propagandist for the ''Mitt.'' You could break out the Felician nuns, to firm up the catholic and Polish vote. Tell the story of ''Mittens'' saving a young hispanic lad from drowning in the Rio grande, all while the ''Mitt'' was doing missionary work for our friends south of the boarder. Get Mitt elected, and get that Postmaster General job you deserve. Maybe get me on as Army Chief Of Staff.

By: Beernazi on 5/24/12 at 10:19

Also, the president can't cut military spending without the blessing of congress. In fact, he can't adjust ANY spending without the approval of congress so it's not like he has 100% oversight of the situation.

By: Loner on 5/24/12 at 10:20

Slack...you got a plan there....if you can't beat 'em. join 'em.

Willard "mitt" Romney, is of sturdy Polish stock...his great grandfather was destitute Polish coal miner in Silesia....Mittliev Romniewski....but he had a dream of coming to America....he hired on as an indentured servant and migrated to Palmyra, New York, where he became a close personal friend of Joseph Smith....shall I go on?

By: yogiman on 5/24/12 at 10:22

brrrrk,

I remember when my first pack of cigarettes was 8 cents a pack in 1938. I quit smoking when they wen to 50 cents a pack in 1968. Too darn high.

By: Loner on 5/24/12 at 10:23

The POTUS signs the budget, otherwise it is a bunch of proposals....that's what I recall from Civics class....he who signs it owns it, IMHO.

By: yogiman on 5/24/12 at 10:24

Rasputin72,

Want a little good reading? Click Sunday Standard 6/27/2004 on google. Several interesting articles there.

By: Loner on 5/24/12 at 10:37

Well then, thank you for not disrespecting me, Rasp. I do not disrespect you too....not quite Kum-Ba-Yah time but we are getting there.

Kids, don't get me wrong, I understand that the special interests fund the politicians and the politicians return the favor in the form of corporate welfare...I dig it.....I was promised Hope & Change in 2008....I had my own brief flirtation with hope for change....No mas!

But the alternative is Willard, the Rat-Boy.....the Jacknife barber of Cranbrook....the draft-dodging chickenhawk....the willing vassal to Bibi Netanyahu....Mister One-Percenter.....the former Mormon underwear model....the mature-looking Ken Doll of the Grand Old Party.....it's a good thing that my vote is functionally worthless in this blue non-battleground state...I can now vote for some 3rd party candidate....as a protest against the EC system and the failed democratic process.