Up for Debate: State pension plans

Monday, April 15, 2013 at 2:08am

What do you think of the state's new pension plan?

Filed under: City Voices

75 Comments on this post:

By: Ask01 on 4/15/13 at 3:51

Once upon a time, government workers toiled for lower than private sector wages over a career expecting in return a steady retirement check after years of loyal service.

This applies, of course to the rank and file only. Elected officials have their own "special" retirements not available to the rest.

I would like to see a reduction for those at the top so the segment of workers who actually perform services for the public can receive a pension without having to contribute. Like that will happen.

Logically, it does make some sense to save money on pensions. People are living longer and therefore drawing more money from pension funds. As long as the new rules apply across the board, to every government employee, including those elected ones, I could grudgingly support the idea.

Of course, those retired will be unaffected, and those within say, ten years of retirement should be grandfathered.

Otherwise, this reeks of some scheme to cheat workers and spread more corporate welfare to political cronies.

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 6:29

Good morning, Nashville.

This is just more anti-worker legislation concocted by the labor-loathing Tea-Baggers in the state government. Since TN's retirement system is well-supported financially, over 90%, (80% is considered adequate), this move is not being motivated by need...it is being motivated by greed.....and just plain Southern meanness,

Once again, unionized public school teachers are in the cross-hairs, as the backwoods legislature tries to make Right-To-Fire Tennessee as unattractive to workers as possible.

The Idea of a Do-It-Yourself pension plan, for state workers, is the latest hair-brained scheme to come out of the TN state house...it's as if Ebeneezer Scrooge was the emperor of Tennessee.

The South enjoyed free slave labor for hundreds of years; after a deal like that, Southerners will never want to pay anybody a fair wage for their labor....this contempt for a man's honest labor is ingrained in the Southern culture.

You get what you pay for.....and the special interests are getting their money's worth.

By: yogiman on 4/15/13 at 7:06

For those of you who ignored my comment about Common Core on the children's education, I suggest you think about going to a meeting on the subject in Franklin TN April 30.

It will be held at the Embassy Suites in the Cool Springs area.

If you have children or grandchildren, it will be worth your knowledge.

In case you haven't heard, the Dept. of Education is taking over the overseeing the test design for a NEW NATIONAL STANDARD.

That, my fellow posters (yea, I know you aren't my friends) is the governments nest step toward communism. One nation, one government, one dictator in control. So if you want to live in a controlled life, ignore it.

By: BigPapa on 4/15/13 at 7:20

Pensions should not be offered to any new employees, or those not currently vested. It's just realistic to expect the public to fund something that the private sector has not just run, but sprinted away from. Only old out dated companies tied to unions still offer a pension, and it's one of the things killing them.

If we stop at least we can plan and know what the cost will be over the next few decades and be out from under the pension requirements eventually. Maybe even offer a buy out for those willing to take it.

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 7:52

There's no doubt about it, Tennessee leads in the race to the bottom in several categories...workers' benefits....school test scores...productivity....federal revenue generation...environmental stewardship....social mobility....religious tolerance etc.

This is not by chance....the leadership in the Volunteer State seems determined to make the place the laughing stock of the nation...a gold mine of of asinine ideas that provide pay dirt for late night comedians...the state legislature seems determined to make Tennessee the most backwards state in the entire union.

So, where is the Democratic Party of Tennessee? Did they fold their tent and move out of state? There is a growing backlash to Slack-jawed Tea-baggerism....time to rise to the occasion.

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 7:56

No unions....no pensions....no minimum wage....no OSHA....no DEC...no nuthin'....that's the ultimate goal for the people of the Volunteer State...eventually, nobody will be paid...what work gets done will be done by volunteers....chain gangs....or a new race of slaves.....Yee Haww!

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 8:07

Seems like the idea of paying someone a decent wage for a good day's work is simply foreign to the Southern mindset....once you've tasted the sweet fruit of slavery; paying anyone anything, in the line of wages, seems like a an unnecessary expense.

In the South, many of the old aristocratic families still rule...and the traditional values still linger....progress is slow or non-existent in many parts of the Old South, as many poor and gullible folks consistently vote against their own best interests. A lousy educational system keeps the flawed system locked in this paradigm...and that is no accident...that is by design.

By: pswindle on 4/15/13 at 8:38

Do we not forget that the workers pay into their retirement?

By: yogiman on 4/15/13 at 9:05

Don't make your boat flop over, Loner. There is good and bad people in every state of the union, including New York. There is also educated people and ignorant people in every state, including New York. Because New York, from the beginning of the nation has a majority of the offices certainly doesn't make it the best state of the Union.

Just wondering, how many people who work in New York; live in New York?

By: BenDover on 4/15/13 at 9:28

Smart Move. They are not messing with any of the commitments that have already been made and are adjusting the future commitments (slightly) in hopes of something that won't bankrupt the state.

Unfunded defined benefit pension and health care obligations are the next big bubble and municipal bankruptcies are an almost certainty for states and cities that don't start reforming them now.

By: Rasputin72 on 4/15/13 at 9:33

Having returned from four days in Augusta with a huge majority of other Republicans.(my guess is that 75 to 80 percent of the patrons were Republican I find immediately that a 46,000 dollar a year retired letter carrier has no idea how wages are set not only in Tennesseee but all over the world.

Only in America can a person of dubious knowledge rant about the evolution of spots on a frogs butt before the Babylonian days without accountabiliy.

The problem in America is that these people breed and vote.

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 9:35

That fact has been conveniently ignored by the haters running the state house, pswindle.

What can one call a government that is motivated primarily by hate? A "Hate-ocracy"? ...maybe, a "Jealous-ocracy"...Nah. too hyphenated....another word for "hate" is "execration", maybe what we have here is an "Execracy"? Nah...sounds like rule by execs... maybe, rule by a malicious and malevolent government could be termed, a "Malocracy"?

Thanks to the malicious Tea-Baggers, the malcontents, Tennessee is now a malocratic state....the Tea-Baggers area gang of malocrats.....on a mission from the dark side.

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 9:40

Ben, TN's pension system is well-funded, according to the article, this move is motivated by greed, not need.

Soon, TN will have the unenviable reputation as the worst state in the union for a working person.

Retiring to TN, to avoid taxes, makes some sense; but working there, as an underpaid, exploited and disposable peon, makes no sense at all. I suppose that illegal aliens will come in and fill the labor gap...for starvation wages and zero bennies....that must be the Master Plan, eh, Ben?

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 9:43

Don't sugar-coat it, Raspy...how do you really feel?

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 9:47

I watched some of the Masters on TV...I saw an obviously pompous-assed, Grey-Poupon-stained, elderly, white man in the crowd of golf-watchers on one of the holes....sipping cheap gin....picking his nose between sips and scratching his crotch....Rasp, was that you?

By: bfra on 4/15/13 at 9:50

Loner - If he had spots on his butt & a sign "I am a teapub" around his neck, that had to have been Raspy.

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 9:55

Thank God, the man did not show his butt to the TV cameras, Bfra...but a teabag was pinned to his designer sportshirt, as I recall....the guy I saw wore a golden monocle in one eye, a Grey-Poupon-stained ascot and he had 1920's-style spats on his designer shoes....had to have been the Rasp.....the cheap gin in the brown paper bag was the give-away.

By: brrrrk on 4/15/13 at 10:05

yogiman said

"That, my fellow posters (yea, I know you aren't my friends) is the governments nest step toward communism. One nation, one government, one dictator in control. So if you want to live in a controlled life, ignore it."

The paranoia is strong in this one - Yoda

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 10:05

Rasp, you are right, I vote and so do my offspring...we are a growing family of love-based beings...our kind will out-populate your kind over time....your breed is moribund, Rasp....like the Neanderthals and the other proto-humans....and there is nothing that you can do about it but whine, pout and pollute comment boards with your nastiness....you are irrelevant, Rasp....the ultimate loser.

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 10:08

Right you are, Brrrrk....paranoid, delusional and dangerous he is.....the dark side he worships.

By: brrrrk on 4/15/13 at 10:09

May the farce be with you....

By: brrrrk on 4/15/13 at 10:22

Seriously yogi, we can't even get the states in this country and half the countries in the world to agree on ANYTHING. And you expect someone to establish a one world government under those circumstances!!!!!! ROFLMFAO......

Hell, even God and Jesus couldn't accomplish that....!!

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 10:28

Brrrrk, don't blow our cover....we both arepaid agents of BHO, the communist Islamic fundamentalist and USURPER-IN-CHIEF....but we are being paid to do our jobs in secret...so, don't blab the Master Plan to Yogi et al.....thanks, comrade....Sieg Heil!

By: BenDover on 4/15/13 at 10:31

Underfunded defined benefits public pensions are a huge problem nation-wide Loner. It's the last piece in the generational theft puzzle; and it's nice to see Tennessee doing something about. it.

States and municipalities have been making promises they can't keep for decades now. The proper thing to do is to stop making such ridiculous promises to the new hires... otherwise it will be the pensioners themselves who are screwed when the States and Municipalities end up bankrupting out on them.

By: BenDover on 4/15/13 at 10:33

http://www.statebudgetsolutions.org/publications/detail/its-overwhelming-state-and-municipal-defined-benefit-pension-plans-doomed-by-fundamental-flaws

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 10:34

Breaking News:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/04/15/new-york-police-officer-kills-boyfriend-son/2084429/

Law-abiding, professionally-trained gun-owners snapping...it's not just for guy's anymore...here come the ladies.

By: brrrrk on 4/15/13 at 10:36

BenDover said

"States and municipalities have been making promises they can't keep for decades now. The proper thing to do is to stop making such ridiculous promises to the new hires... otherwise it will be the pensioners themselves who are screwed when the States and Municipalities end up bankrupting out on them."

From the skewed world of BenDover, where even the guy flipping burgers at Mickey D's can manage their own 401K... that is if they even get one.

By: Rasputin72 on 4/15/13 at 10:37

LONER.......After you have achieved your goal of eliminating those who have achieved heaven on earth, then it will be you who have to contend with the 47% PLUS who have contributed nothing.

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 10:39

Strip the workers of their dignity...strip their benefits...strip 'em good....yeah, that's the way of the future...slave labor wasn't all that bad....the South is going retro....and this time around, the African Negroes aren't the only ones being targeted...today, screwing the worker is an equal opportunity business....the goal is to screw them all, to break their will, to make them grovel for a slave-wage job...like in the days of old...before the damn Yankees screwed it all up....The South's Gonna Dive Again! Yeeee Haaawww!

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 10:43

Yes, our goal is to eliminate those who have achieved heaven on earth, Rasp...you have achieved a kind of personal hell, in which you are consumed by the fires of hate and contempt...so, you are relatively safe from our agenda. Suffer like succotash...we do not care, Rasp.

By: Rasputin72 on 4/15/13 at 10:45

LONER...........Speaking of hate? It is not my fault that you have underachieved!!!

By: brrrrk on 4/15/13 at 10:55

Raspy,

Poke enough holes in the boat, and you go down with it too....

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 10:58

I admit it, as a hater, I am outclassed by the Rasp....as a hater, he is a super-achiever....I am a classic underachiever in that category....you get tht trophy, Rasp...the Hater's Cup.

By: yogiman on 4/15/13 at 10:58

Well, Loner,

Since you aren't a "not paid" secret agent for the UIO (usurper in office), how much are you being paid as as "open agent"?

And by the way, I'm still waiting for proof your buddy is in that office legally. It's been over 4 years now, can't you come up with any evidence at all to prove me wrong?

Or do you live by a different constitution than I? Or do you just think [to hell with the one we have]? I like the original one.

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 10:59

Brrrrk, guys like Ben and Rasp do not understand that a rising tide lifts all boats....foolish landlubbers!

By: brrrrk on 4/15/13 at 11:00

yogiman said

"And by the way, I'm still waiting for proof your buddy is in that office legally. It's been over 4 years now, can't you come up with any evidence at all to prove me wrong?"

Yogi, you still haven't provided evidence that you don't molest farm animals... "at all to prove me wrong?"

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 11:04

Yogi...I cannot disclose my salary...part of the covenant that I swore when I took that personal loyalty oath to BHO....let's just say that Rasputin's estimate of my annual income is low...because of IRS concerns, I cannot say any more than that....once our revolution is complete, I will be handsomely rewarded for my service to my liege lord....he may appoint me as Viceroy to the Tennessee Territory....that's what I expect, after the dust settles.

By: bfra on 4/15/13 at 11:05

Raspy - If what you have is "Heaven on Earth" to you, I will take "My World" over that anytime!

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 11:06

I agree with Brrrrk, until Yogi can prove that he has not had sex with farm animals, we can assume that he has engaged in animal husbandry. Prove your innocence, Yogi!

By: brrrrk on 4/15/13 at 11:13

In light of how much the uber rich in this country complain about the egregious taxes that they pay, one has to wonder why they simply don't pick up and leave the country... lock, stock and barrel. After all, It's not like their lives would significantly change.

Could it be because of the fact that the United States (from the last information I saw) is 31st in the world when it comes to the individual maximum income tax? And that the countries below that tax rate (with the exception of a few) are basically third world countries?

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 11:15

True that, Bfra...one man's pain is another man's pleasure...one man's trash is another man's treasure....Rasp's delusional world sounds more hellish than heavenly....good thing it's all just his fantasy, not reality....poor devil.

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 11:19

Good point, Brrrrk. Other than to Israel, if they are Jewish, where can the uber-rich go, to get a better deal than they enjoy right here, in the USA? They bitch and they moan but they still reside here...proof of their vacuous hypocrisy.

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 11:22

Israel has a superb national healthcare system, that is why I used that state in my 2:19 example....the rich can get terribly sick in Israel and that will not affect their personal wealth in any way...that's a pretty big plus, as compared to our situation in the states.

By: yogiman on 4/15/13 at 11:28

Loner,

Perhaps you can tell me what kind of birth certificate Barry mentioned in his autobiography. I'm not trying to act as a salesman for him, but read page 26, where he was mentioning his Kenyan father and remarked: "I discovered this article, folded away among my BIRTH CERTIFICATE and old vaccination forms, when I was in high school".

He was mentioning an article in the Honolulu Star-Bulletin his father had written after he had graduated from college.

If he had his birth certificate when he was in high school, why did he say he couldn't get as copy of it because the state government wouldn't allow it? So where did he get that "copy" when he was "backed up against the wall?

And I'm sure you know why he advertised he was born in Kenya and raised in Indonesia and Hawaii for 16 years from 1991 to 1997. Mind telling me?

And by the way, when did he announce he was running for the presidency?

As I have stated before; if he was born in Hawaii and adopted into Indonesian citizenship, how could he later become a [natural born citizen] of the USA?

You need to get some facts, Loner. If you have any, I'd sure like to know them so I can "get off your back".

Heck, I've got a lot to do on my farm this summer.

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 11:29

If we live long enough, it's a safe bet that medical care costs will suck off every penny of our personal wealth before we die.....lawyers can help defray the damage to some extent...there are tricks to preserving an estate from health-cost-caused bankruptcy...loopholes etc.....but that's a lousy way to run a country, IMO.

Every pirate knows, wealth cannot purchase good health.... aye matey, that's the rub.....Aaarrrr.

By: brrrrk on 4/15/13 at 11:31

Loner said

"Israel has a superb national healthcare system, that is why I used that state in my 2:19 example....the rich can get terribly sick in Israel and that will not affect their personal wealth in any way...that's a pretty big plus, as compared to our situation in the states."

True, but they would have to deal with triage style medicine; waiting in line with all the other unwashed....that would be totally unacceptable!! No, they need to go someplace where all their needs would be handled at their beck and call.....

Waiting in line is just so pedestrian...

By: brrrrk on 4/15/13 at 11:34

yogiman said

"Heck, I've got a lot to do on my farm this summer."

Yes Loner, he's a busy busy man.... so many sheep, so few days.

But when he gets a chance he'll get right baaaaaa-ck to you.....

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 11:35

Yes, please do get off our backs here, Yogi...go mount your livestock, if you must, but don't continue to demand that we squeal like a pig....thank you.

Go play your banjo with your miscreant neighbors....I can hear the strains of Dueling Banjos....Deliverance in your colorful language....Bah, Dah, Bing, Bong, Bing...

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 11:41

Yes..a cowboy's work is never done...same goes for the sheepboys and the goatboys....I suppose that the fowl-loving boys...the chickenboys, the duckboys and the gooseboys are equally vexed.....as are the rabbitboys.

By: Loner on 4/15/13 at 11:42

Yogi joined the Navy, hoping to be placed aboard a ewe boat.