Letter to the Editor

Thursday, November 11, 2010 at 11:00pm
Posted by "AmyLiorate"

While I agree with the spirit of the [ACLU] case — and indeed we don't have debtors prison in this country — one has to wonder about what this may lead to.

Sure you have fulfilled your sentence, oh wait — except for that restitution. So in effect you haven't completed paying (literally) for your crime. So now would it be more prudent for the judge to put you back into jail for contempt after not paying for a year?

Probably not. But look at the case of someone who isn't paying child support. Since people are often never jailed for non-payment but still in contempt, the ACLU's statement doesn't apply: 
“Denying voting rights to those who have served their time based solely on their inability to pay a particular debt amounts to unconstitutional discrimination.”

Personally, I think that once someone has not paid child support for several months, a good wake up call would be to spend a few hours in jail, just a holding cell. That would probably shock most people and spur them to action. 

Filed under: City Voices
Tagged: ACLU | child support

113 Comments on this post:

By: dargent7 on 11/12/10 at 5:51

Problem with your theory for a "wake up call" is there aren't enough "holding cells" to be used as a classroom.
Many, if not all DUI arrests spend the entire night in jail and don't give up drunk driving.
"Dead beat Dads" have their paychecks garnished. If that doesn't work, a few hours in the slammer won't, either.

By: Loner on 11/12/10 at 5:58

Good morning, Nashville!

Is this a Reader's Comment or an LTE? Since a username was used, it looks like a Reader's Comment, not an LTE. In any event, congrats, Amy; you have been recognized.

I wonder just what legal case Amy's comment is referring to; something about an ACLU matter. A little more background info would have helped to focus and illuminate Amy's main points.

The dead beat dad scenario is all too common these days; but for some reason, it's the "welfare moms" who are bashed and demonized, not the foot-loose and fancy free "welfare studs". I've never once heard a conservative talk show host criticize the dead beat dads; their utter contempt for the "welfare moms", on the other hand, is passionate and notorious. Eve, not Adam, once again gets the blame.....it's the Judeo Christian way.

By: Loner on 11/12/10 at 6:21

Here's a fool-proof plan to end the unwanted teen pregnancy problem:

At the ageof puberty, all boys should deposit some of their sperm into a sperm bank(s) and then go for a vasectomy. If they really wanted to father a child, they could make a withdrawal of their sperm and use in vitrio fertilization to accomplish that.

Using my "draconian" plan, unwanted pregnancies and "shotgun marriages" would soon be unheard of; divorce rates and abortion rates would plummet, all kids would be genuinely wanted and the taxpayers would be saving huge amounts of money.

Never gonna happen...too many professional zealots would then be out of work.

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/12/10 at 6:33

I agree with Amy. If a person owes restitiution to a victim for a crime they committed then is picked up for a probation violation and their sentence is put into effect, they do not have to pay the victim restitution. What kind of crap is that? "Restitiution" is given in lieu of serving time so if they end up serving time, no restitution needs to be paid.

By: bfra on 11/12/10 at 6:54

Loner - This was a comment. Lately more comments have turned into letters, than actual letters being presented.

Blanket, if there weren't so many crappie little lawyers, chasing easy fees, the laws might get more correctly enforced.

By: bfra on 11/12/10 at 6:56

What is Drupal that keeps popping up at times, when trying to connect to the CP? Anyone know?

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/12/10 at 6:57

bfra, it's not necessarily the lawyers, it's the judges and the legislature. the cops and the DA can do everything under the sun to make sure a criminal goes away but it's ultimately up to the judge and what mood they are in.

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/12/10 at 7:00

sentencing guidelines need to be revised across the board. having a crime committed reduced to a lesser crime then getting probation or only serving 30% of the lesser crime is not justice.

By: bfra on 11/12/10 at 7:01

I agree about the judges, we have some of the worst, but these lawyers take cases, right or wrong, just for the fees. Some knowing there really is NO case or not enough evidence to win.

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/12/10 at 7:02

especially for violent offenders, 8 years should mean 8 years - not 28 months then even less once you factor in jail credit and good behavior. that's a slap in the face to the victim.

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/12/10 at 7:03

i'd agree with that, bfra. you're referring to civil court and i'm talking criminal court. i agree with you on the civil court side.

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/12/10 at 7:05

I'm a bit confused about Amy's point. i know of cases where people were arrested for not paying child support. Amy's quote of the ACLU has to do with voting rights. apples and oranges. hopefully she'll sign on and explain that part which didn't end up in the LTE today.

By: bfra on 11/12/10 at 7:06

I'm talking about both.

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/12/10 at 7:08

i'm missing your point on the criminal side, bfra.

btw, TGIPF!!!!!

By: bfra on 11/12/10 at 7:09

The ACLU & NAACP, 2 of the biggest raciest organizations ever, should be banned. Jesse & Al for two, would have to come up with another way to scam money.

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/12/10 at 7:11

Loner, i agree with your comment about deadbeat dads. somehow i never thought about how the media focuses on the welfare moms and not the welfare "studs." good point.

btw, how was your Willie costume at Halloween? 8`)

By: bfra on 11/12/10 at 7:11

The lawyers & judges in both courts are just as scheming or crooked. Note: Not All

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/12/10 at 7:12

bfra, i don't always agree with either organization but saying they should be banned is a scary concept.

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/12/10 at 7:13

bfra, i'm no fan of the legal system either! unfortunately it's still better than many other places worldwide.

By: bfra on 11/12/10 at 7:13

How about the moms that make a living off their babies & child support?

By: bfra on 11/12/10 at 7:15

Blanket, I think we would be better off with out either, especially the ACLU.

By: govskeptic on 11/12/10 at 7:15

Her letter/comment refers back to an action the ACLU has
brought against the state of Tenn over a law passed within
the last few yrs on voting rights, I believe. Law took away
voting rights of those convicted of felony but haven't paid the
fines/restitution portion of sentence. Also includes those behind in
child support. I don't think the two should be tied together.
While we all wish dead-beat dad's should pay up, they are in
this reader's opinion in a totally different catagory than those
convicted of a felony. In cases where ACLU wins the least
little portion of cases brought, Federal Judges award them
pretty nice taxpayer funded fees in the case. What a system!

By: dargent7 on 11/12/10 at 7:16

This was just one "post" by Amy from a few days ago. Who knows what the LTE she was posting to or the comment she was addressing was about then? Had she known this was going to be printed, she may have tightened it up and worked on it.
Posting here is done quickly, and alot don't put much thought into it.
"yogi", for example :~)

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/12/10 at 7:19

gov, i agree that the two should not be tied together. a thought a felon was not allowed to vote? if they owe no fees and paid their restitution they can vote?

By: bfra on 11/12/10 at 7:21

I could be wrong but doesn't a "felon" conviction stay on their record indefinitely?

By: budlight on 11/12/10 at 7:21

dargent7 on 11/12/10 at 7:16
This was just one "post" by Amy from a few days ago. Who knows what the LTE she was posting to or the comment she was addressing was about then? Had she known this was going to be printed, she may have tightened it up and worked on it.
Posting here is done quickly, and alot don't put much thought into it.
"yogi", for example :~)

D7 as well (:

It's hard for you to think D7 when you usually let the other posters guide you. At least Yogi has a mind of his own and original thoughts. Have a nice play day at the CP!

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/12/10 at 7:22

bfra, it does unless steps are taken for expungement which isn't available for all offenders.

By: bfra on 11/12/10 at 7:23

Oh my! Must be goat feeding day.

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/12/10 at 7:23

my understanding was that once a felony conviction is expunged the felon then is given back voting rights. but i may be wrong....

By: Loner on 11/12/10 at 7:24

BN, the Wilie Nelson "costume" worked very well; i got an honorable mention. The band picks the winners and they always pick chicks in skimpy outfits...as it should be.
The band's lead singer's wife later came up to me and said that I should have won...others agreed.

I wore my leather duster, my leather cowboy hat (purchased in Nashville), a red bandanna around my neck, Willie Nelson T-shirt and new blue jeans...cuffs rolled up, Western style....wore my boots too, of course.

For a guitar prop I bought a Paper Jamz toy guitar at Walmart...the thing plays all the major and minor chords...no strings....touch-sensitive frets do the job. It's a great toy, I can't stop fooling around with it.

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/12/10 at 7:25

nice job, Loner!

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/12/10 at 7:25

gotta go. have a great weekend, everyone!

By: bfra on 11/12/10 at 7:26

Blanket, I think you are right, but there again, expungment, goes back to really, who you know or pay.

By: bfra on 11/12/10 at 7:27

Blanket - Have a good weekend and slow down! lol

By: Loner on 11/12/10 at 7:29

Thanks, BN, have a great day and a superb weekend.

By: Loner on 11/12/10 at 7:31

Darge, if the NCP is lifting our posts and showcasing some of them, we had better start using Spellcheck etc. This is a good thing, IMO, we'll all take it up a notch...Ok, maybe not all of us; some are already peaking out.

By: dargent7 on 11/12/10 at 7:43

In 2 years, they've only "lifted" three: gdiaf's, yours, and now, AmyL.
They did print, one time only, one of Sidiot's gibberish.
She immediately denied writing it saying it was stolen, "from her files".
The X-Files.

By: gdiafante on 11/12/10 at 7:47

You're right, darge, I forgot they lifted one of mine before.

By: bfra on 11/12/10 at 7:48

d7 - That Eddie A, free book promotion, was a comment, under another subject and then appeared as a letter.

By: dargent7 on 11/12/10 at 8:11

gD: Yes, as my ex-wife always said," you got a memory like an elephant".
The follow up was, "now, get out!" (think of Jackie Gleason yelling to Norton).

By: Loner on 11/12/10 at 8:31

So, we're all going to a free dinner, compliments of the NCP? Just kidding.

That Eddie A. guy hasn't been seen nor heard from since his free ad went into the archives...gotta hand it to him, he's got ambition and chutzpah.

I just penned a post for the Jerusalem Post; I doubt if it will be posted...should have sent it in as an LTE.

Hillary Clinton recently assured PM Netanyahu that Israel will be able to garrison troops in any future Palestinian state and that the USA would provide the extra cash to bankroll the indefinite occupation of the proposed state.

The expanded and accelerated JEWS ONLY settlement blocks on Arab lands is being described as "unhelpful", by the Obama Administration. How wimpy is that?

Of course, US aid to the apartheid Jewish State will continue to bankroll the ethnic cleansing, Jim Crow and apartheid. US aid to the Jewish state is something of an entitlement.... a sacred cow...nobody is going to suggest any cuts there.

Barack Hussein Obama, the Nobel Laureate, is powerless.....AIPAC has him by the presidential scrotum. As we know, 87 US Senators are always ready to sign any letter that AIPAC writes on behalf of the Israelis.

The Israelis plan to run out the clock on President Obama, hoping that an even more compliant Republican president will replace him after the 2012 elections....standing in the wings: Eric Cantor.

The Palestinians are now talking about a "unilateral" plan in which they would ask the UN General Assembly to recognize their state along the 1967 lines. Israel's own legitimacy traces back to a UN General Assembly Resolution, so they are very concerned about this. The USA has condemned this "unilateral" option..the Israelis insist that we condemn the idea. It's the old "existential threat" rhetoric....once again.

By: gdiafante on 11/12/10 at 8:51

I have it on good authority that the next President of the United States will be...

the corpse of Burt Lancaster.

By: budlight on 11/12/10 at 9:00

In the "good ole' days" if one did not pay child support they went to jail. They should. And if they don't pay their restitution in any type of case, then the time is not fully served.

D7, you can "dish" it out, but can you take it? Are you still banned from Tennessean?

How did that ever happen? You are so fair and balanced.

By: Loner on 11/12/10 at 9:15

George Bernard Shaw claimed that for something to be genuinely humorous, there must be an element of truth in it . I agree.

By: yogiman on 11/12/10 at 9:19

Thanks for your comment, budlight. Its good to know who your friends are, but its better to know who your enemies are. Your friends you don't have to worry about. Your enemies tell you who and what they are.

As for the original post on this issue. You have men who are only interested in women for one purpose... satisfaction; sexually that is. But you also have women who's goal is to go out and have children to gain child support and welfare. That way they don't have to go out and make a living.

Sadly, the ones hurt worst by these conflicts are the children.

By: gdiafante on 11/12/10 at 9:24

Didn't Shaw also say something like worthless people should be killed?

By: Loner on 11/12/10 at 9:29

Yogi has certainly bought into the idea of the "welfare mom", too lazy to earn a living, procreating for fun and profit.

No mention nor hint of any blame for the "welfare studs", of course....they're just acting like men, no responsibility on their male shoulders or parts below, it's the women's crotches to blame. It's all the fault of these welfare whores...screwing old Yogi out his quality of life...damn bitches!

Again, Old Yogi must be listening to the perverse Christian hate radio broadcasts, this is one of their familiar themes...it was all Eve's fault, not Adam's....damn bitches!

By: Loner on 11/12/10 at 9:30

Bring it on.

By: slacker on 11/12/10 at 9:42

Deadbeat Dads & Welfare Mom's, a subculture created by LBJ's ''Great Society'' program. A well intentioned idea, that is defeated by human nature.

By: gdiafante on 11/12/10 at 9:51

It's only going to get worse, slacker. Reality TV is now giving "celebrity" status to teen mothers. It will be every teenagers dream to get knocked up and become famous.

I guess this supercedes having multiple births...Kate Gosselin is so passe.

By the way, two of her kids have been expelled from a private school for language and violence. Go figure.