Letters to the Editor

Sunday, November 1, 2009 at 10:32pm

The alternative to deadly force

[We've seen] yet another death by Taser, which were designed and implemented to prevent deaths not cause them — by providing an alternative to using a gun and not to replace chemical weapons or brute force as they are used now.

Too many people are dying from them and it is time to return to original intent and investigate any Taser use as if a shooting occured to justify its proper use. If there is not justification to use deadly force a Taser should not be used.

If the police departments don't want to clean up their own houses then Legislature should act and ban them before another death occurs.

It wouldn't be justified to shoot a fleeing man with handcuffs on arrested for a minor offense, so why was he tased to death? To top it all off, they had a dog that could have ran him down.

Tasers are being abused and people are dying from them. Stop it and stop it NOW.

Frank Briamonte, 37138

 

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Filed under: City Voices
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306 Comments on this post:

By: dargent7 on 11/2/09 at 4:44

Disagree. "A fleeing man in handcuffs" ....sya it all. Was he running to a church Bible class or AA Meeting? Doubtful. People who do not respond to a Police officer's commands are looking for trouble. Shoot the bas*ards. And the K-9 Unit probably didn't want another lawsuit filed and lein placed against his Dog Chow.

By: Loner on 11/2/09 at 6:03

Good morning, Nashville!

I am not familiar with the incident referenced in the LTE, so I won't comment on that particular case.. The LTE itself is not well-written, IMO, though I tend to agree with the author - when tasers kill, somebody should be held liable.

By: dargent7 on 11/2/09 at 6:18

Nemo: "Held libel"?....yes, the perp who's running away, defiant, uncooperative with Police.
That Sgt. recovering from 5 gunshots should of Tasered the two guys who were approaching his patrol car.
His life is 10x more relevant than two "Lifers" sucking society dry.

By: dargent7 on 11/2/09 at 6:19

Sorry, Loner. I attributed your unusual gibberish to the usual gabby "Nemo".
My staff regrets the error.

By: Loner on 11/2/09 at 6:37

Libel and liable are too different items. I checked it out...(from the web)

Libel = a false and malicious publication printed for the purpose of defaming a living person.

Liable = subject to legal action; "liable to criminal charges".

I believe that I used the correct term, in the proper context.

"Unusual gibberish"? Please explain.

By: dargent7 on 11/2/09 at 6:45

Loner: Explaination is two fold:
. I type in the dark and I haven't set my clocks backward yet. You're spelling of "liable" is obviously correct.
. I thought I'd get the ball rolling with insults early. Last Fri. we had a real "Hootennany" on this board. If Gd. and Nemo had met up with Chief and BenD, there would of been a triple homicide. I've never read such viceral hatred for one another. Maybe "Devil's Night" was taken too literal?

By: Loner on 11/2/09 at 7:02

Tasers are advertised as being "non-lethal" defensive tools. I'm not a legal scholar, but it is reasonable to conclude that a case for "wrongful death" might be pursued in the courts when someone is killed by a taser. The taser manufacturer and the person who killed with a taser (and his/her employer) could all be targets of such lawsuits.

Don't get me wrong, the police have a very tough job and they have to deal with dangerous situations all the time. Having said that, police departments need to police their own and purge themselves of the sadists, the racists, the bigots and the misogynous within their ranks. It is this minority of abusive police officers who bring shame and dishonor to the badge.

By: dargent7 on 11/2/09 at 7:13

Not to belabor the topic....but the Police are always sued for lethal force via a gunshot. "Wrongfull death" suits always accompany a Police shooting .
Even when a K-9 unit brings down a perp, they sue.
At least Tasers restrain a perp with a viable chance to live thru it. Maybe the mfg. can lower the voltage to 3,000 from 5,000?

By: house_of_pain on 11/2/09 at 7:14

The only way to settle this is for you 2 to battle it out, "Thunderdome" style...
with Tasers.

By: house_of_pain on 11/2/09 at 7:16

Or "Beer Summit" style at Nemo's, Beernazi permitting.

By: Loner on 11/2/09 at 7:18

I see, Dargent7.....a little verbal towel-snapping on an early Monday morning is just what we need.

Actually, I don't really like the discord and rancor. I like to find common ground with folks who disagree with me. Muck-raking is one thing, mischief-making is quite another. Syd-baiting, for example, is not my style. Ben Dover and I disagree on many points, but we refrain from personal attacks...it's the only way to go, IMO.

A little human passion is good, I suppose. Fights are entertaining, no doubt about it; settling old animosities and such is boring and there's little money it.

They don't do reality TV shows about reasonable and tolerant folks...who cares about the lives of cooler heads, accomodators and appeasers? People want to see foul-mouthed knuckleheads mud-wrestling, not pussies making peace.

By: Loner on 11/2/09 at 7:25

House checks in with his usual comedic flair.

House, we need you here....you defuse the bombs.

By: dargent7 on 11/2/09 at 7:25

I think the psychological process at work on these "boards" is particularly interesting. No one's ever met anyone, yet feel personally slighted by comments and do take them, "personally". I know I do.
When Bend-O gives his boiler plate rant on the hero worship of GW Bush I want to strangle him....in a very civil way.
And with regard to Sid"V"...I don't even want to go there.
It's all for fun and entertainment. But, go to a Titans game to see a "game" take on personal meaning. (Dr. Freud, over and out).

By: Kosh III on 11/2/09 at 7:28

Loner.
Well said, civil discourse is better if less entertaining.
Keep up the good work Loner....."you ignorant slut." :)

By: Loner on 11/2/09 at 7:36

I agree, D7. I sometimes think that regular, on-line posters are like the ham radio operators of yesteryear, or maybe like the CB crowd, back in the seventies. Will humans "burn out" on this too? Is the global village that McLuhan predicted here to stay? Is the medium the message? Is online posting, in McLuhanistic terms "hot" or "cool"?

Or we could talk about God, Guns, Gays and Guvmint.

By: Loner on 11/2/09 at 7:38

Thanks, Kosh, I needed that. I really am an ignorant slut. I don't know jack and I'm easy.

By: dargent7 on 11/2/09 at 7:40

"House checked IN"? "House" checked OUT years ago.

By: slacker on 11/2/09 at 7:46

Kumbaya my lord.. Kumbayaaaaaaaaaa

By: Loner on 11/2/09 at 7:52

To digress... I had a great time at the C&S Saloon in Brockport, NY, Halloween night. I went as a monk. Black robe, do-rag, leather belt and boots. Chicks want what they can't have.

One comely young lass asked to pose for a picture with "Brother Loner"....(of course, I copped an avuncular feel)....all the ladies seemed to be dressed as sluts this year...it reminded me of my summer retreat. Life is good.

Only the band members and a couple of passed out bar-flies were older than me....somebody has to teach the young ones how to party...it is my mission.

By: Loner on 11/2/09 at 8:00

Slacker enters the forum, Gembay drumming...the lion sleeps this morning. The villagers are happy. A white dove descends upon the dancing, noble savages. The white smoke from the pipe of peace curls its way heavenward.

By: dooley on 11/2/09 at 8:10

loner the reason you think the letter wasn't written is probably Idgaf is the author . It's been a long dry spell for him but I agree with the intent of his rant.

By: dooley on 11/2/09 at 8:12

well written

By: govskeptic on 11/2/09 at 8:18

Hang em high & shoot on sight is getting old in this Taser
contraversy. The number of people that have died in the
use of tasers over 6 yrs exceeds that killed in schools nation wide over more than 20 yrs. Go figure!

By: slacker on 11/2/09 at 8:20

I think if Mr. Briamonte, could hear the sound that a nightstick produces when it strikes a skull, & see some pics. of dog bite wounds, he might might change his opinion on Taser use in apprehensions. Excessive force is occasionally going to happen, and the prevention of that, is the message to preach.

By: Kosh III on 11/2/09 at 8:21

"somebody has to teach the young ones how to party...it is my mission."

oooo, such a horrible burden. I'm glad someone was brave enough to undertake the mission. ")

By: Loner on 11/2/09 at 8:21

Dooley, I wondered if this was an Idgaf piece. His verbal skills are actually improving. I'm not an English teacher, but I detected a few flaws. The subjects of some of the sentences and clauses were unclear or ambigous and caused confusion. A few well-placed commas might have helped.

Overall, it was a good letter, but not a great letter, in my opinion. Idgaf calling for more "guvmint" intervention seems out of character, he's now calling for more laws. He seems to distrust the police, conservatives usually defer to "law and order" authority.

By: chiefpayne568 on 11/2/09 at 8:26

Dargent,

"If Gd. and Nemo had met up with Chief and BenD, there would of been a triple homicide. I've never read such viceral hatred for one another. Maybe "Devil's Night" was taken too literal?"

I must take exception to my inclusion in this statement. I rather thought I was relatively cordial considering that I was continuously insulted by Gd, Nemo, and, jumping in once in a while, Blanket. I didn't use profanity and I only returned insults when presented with them...and not always at that.

However, I must admit I DID add insults to the pile and so apologize for such.

By: Loner on 11/2/09 at 8:33

Yes, Kosh, it is a job for a loner... it is a lonely job, the rewards are earthly, it's not a job for plaster saints. Society scorns my ilk and celebrates our losses, but we persist in our noble endeavor, undaunted by the howling masses and the braying moralist agitators who exploit them.

By: CAH on 11/2/09 at 8:34

There has never been a "non-lethal" device made that will never be fatal. Murphy's Law applies.

Deaths involving Tasers can mostly be attributed to an underlying condition. Mostly it's drugs or alcohol. Sometimes it is a heart condition that would be unknown to the officer.

The practice is to train the officers by hitting them with a taser so that they know how it feels. If we take away the tasers, we would have to go back to using the guns. Would Frank rather that we shoot our officers so they would know how that feels? I would hope not, though any Liberal probably would.

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/2/09 at 8:38

By: house_of_pain on 11/2/09 at 7:16
Or "Beer Summit" style at Nemo's, Beernazi permitting

I don't see this as an either/or! LOL

By: Loner on 11/2/09 at 8:46

Technology is advancing rapidly. The technology enabling the authorities to disable your car remotely is already out there. The technology to implant a locating/disabling chip into the brains of all new-borns is only a few years away....the will to implant such devices is already here. Again, it's for our own good, for our personal safety and security of person.....it's for the children. Who could oppose such a wonderful idea?

By: chiefpayne568 on 11/2/09 at 8:49

Loner,

Anyone who has read 1984, who has seen Logan's Run, or who has any knowledge of freedom would oppose such uses of technology!

By: dargent7 on 11/2/09 at 9:00

Chief: You need to watch more "Dirty Harry" movies. I'd rather be "Tased" than looking down the barrel of a .357 Magnum.
Watch "Heat" for a gun remedial by Police.

By: slacker on 11/2/09 at 9:07

The govt. is already implanting micro-chips into the citizenry, with the so called flu shot. They can now hear, and see everything you do. Be afraid.
But the good news is you probably won't get the flu, or get lost.

By: chiefpayne568 on 11/2/09 at 9:09

Dargent,

Oh I'd rather be tased than being shot any day of the week.

BUT I have to wonder why someone would die due to tasing. I personally think they should have a regualtor switch on them so they can regulate how bad the charge can be.

That way, if they have, say a small young woman giving them problems, they can use the lowere setting and if they have a large man giving them problems, they can set it higher.

Now I don't know much about tasers so don't know if they already have one of these...but it would seem logical to me to had a setting switch on one.

By: Loner on 11/2/09 at 9:10

Perhaps, Chief. The good reasons are well-financed and well-articulated. The real reasons for any given action are always obscure and sometimes counter-intuitive.

When governance is by way of lobbyist financed "public" servants, we cannot rely on government to be of, for or by the People. When it comes to legislatuve innovation, If there is a buck in it, or a vote in it, good reasons will be found to support it.

We must get the drunk-with-power special interests out of the national driver's seat, this careening democratic republic is headed for Dead-man's Curve.... stimulus air-bags won't help.

By: chiefpayne568 on 11/2/09 at 9:12

Slacker,

I know I'll get the shot...even though I've already had the swine flu! :-(

By: chiefpayne568 on 11/2/09 at 9:16

Loner,

I agree!

"When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic." -- Benjamin Franklin

By: slacker on 11/2/09 at 9:19

chief, good idea. You won't have to buy a GPS.

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/2/09 at 9:21

do you know what you get when you mix a GPS with PMS?

By: Loner on 11/2/09 at 9:21

Sounds like a tune in there, D7....(Blues format) I'd rather be tasered than shot... though the pain of the voltage is hot....I'd rather not.....be shot. (sax riff here) Mr. Spock had his phaser, the man got his Taser, I'd rather be tasered than shot....

Take it away, House...

By: chiefpayne568 on 11/2/09 at 9:23

Loner,

WOW...sounds like you have a promising career there!

By: slacker on 11/2/09 at 9:24

An irritated stalker?

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/2/09 at 9:24

By: slacker on 11/2/09 at 9:24
An irritated stalker?

Close. A crazy woman who WILL find you - lol!

By: Loner on 11/2/09 at 9:28

BN, PMS & GPS....LOL.

By: Blanketnazi2 on 11/2/09 at 9:29

lol! the trinity of terror!

By: chiefpayne568 on 11/2/09 at 9:30

Slacker,

No problem...I'll just find some way to fry the chip. Maybe an emp or something?

By: chiefpayne568 on 11/2/09 at 9:30

Blanket,

Is there any other kind of crazy woman???

By: dargent7 on 11/2/09 at 9:31

Chief: Brilliant idea...have a switch on the Taser: First, select: "Male" or "Female".
Then; "Press1" for "White", 2 for "Black", 3 for Latino", 4 for "Asian". Have the Taser talk to you like that sexy broad in my car's GPS system. Or, how about the as**hole does whatever the Police officer says?

By: Loner on 11/2/09 at 9:31

Thanks, Chief, if anyone can get us into a studio down there or on the radio, the Loners will come on down and take Nashville by surprise...or not.